New Windows Scrivener customer here - I’m loving it so far and would buy an android app in a heartbeat. I’ll scan over on the Mac side and see what you’re planning since that will be the blueprint. Certainly number one with a bullet would be the ability to peruse online projects and have some editing capability. I’m imagining having the muse hit you when mobile and whipping off a few hundred words.
Cheers,
DT
Any update on Scrivener for Android and iOS? I read you recently brought on an iOS developer to help work on this. Which is awesome, but unfortunate for the reasons. I have immediate family issues as well so I know she’s doing the right thing.
Have you folks thought about doing a Kickstarter to raise the capital to bring in staff or hire a company to get it out the door? I would certainly back enough for my own copy on Android, possibly more depending on the structure of ‘bonuses’. 
Thanks again,
-Chad
We have no need of a Kickstarter campaign - the issue isn’t funds so much as doing things right. There is no point starting an Android version while we are still working on the iOS version. The iOS version is our testbed for getting the mobile design right. Once that is done right and out the door, we can start on the Android version.
All the best,
Keith
Any screenshots for iOS you can tantalize us with?
Thank you kindly,
-Chad
Adding a vote for an Android version of Scrivener. I am loving the Windows version, can’t wait for it to catch up to the Mac version, and would buy the Android version day one.
Of course I will be sad when I see the iOS version released first, but I guess someone has to be the test monkeys 
Another vote for Android.
I had been doing the bulk of my writing on a Kindle Fire (using a Word emulator and Dropbox). Decided to try Scrivener (Windows) and love it . . . but now I’m bound to my desktop PC for everything. 
Another vote, beg, plea, whatever you want to call it!
Another vote for an android version here. As tablets surpass laptops, and some can even use Bluetooth keyboards, it appears to me at least that android is a necessary platform for Scrivener, just as much as iOS is.
I don’t personally appreciate Keith’s strategy at all.
I prefer to do my heavy editing on my Macbook’s Scrivener and could just do with a light Android (and WP) app that would have simple split view (enabling adding and arranging text files in the same fashion as in the desktop version) which would go full screen when editing text. That’s it.
I must not be the only one who prefers working such a way. After all we paid to have Scrivener because Word is not for us. Word is for folks who don’t know any better (or simply don’t care), or who can’t use anything else in their line of work.
We on the other hand want to write, take writing seriously, and thus just want to streamline our workflow so that writing can be as fluent process as possible when ever the inspiration should strike with what ever we happen to have at hand then.
For most people today that item is their phone. And it’s now been close to 20 months with nothing to show. People are running out of patience and I for one can hardly blame them.
So, I’m sorry to be the first one to say this out loud but the chosen strategy isn’t exactly working (for us at least - your primary customers?).
It truthfully seems like you guys could in fact need some help, and for that a Kickstarter campaign could in all honesty work wonders - and fast, too! Or otherwise you really ought to consider revising your strategy when it comes to mobile apps.
The world is changing fast around us and sticking to fantasies about delivering perfect products could prove to be a disastrous path indeed.
To cap, why make everybody wait forever for stuff that most folks will likely never even find a real use for?
Don’t you just love it when you see it? I’m sure Young Master Kevin will.
It seems some explanations will never suit… unless it’s the one, that one wants to hear/read
Welcome aboard Scrivener Young Master Stupid,
Fluff (flack-proofed)
Exactly. 
stupidAT[etc]: you don’t have to appreciate our strategy; it’s our strategy nonetheless. A Kickstarter campaign would be an immoral approach for a profitable company, and in fact getting on board more developers would result in slower development, not faster development. It’s a myth that more developers = faster production, especially on such a product as Scrivener. We do not sell an iOS version at the moment and we do not say we do; we just say that we are developing one, and yes, it’s taken longer than we would have liked, but that’s the nature of software development. We have never said that an Android version is in development, though - only that we would like to do one in the future. Users should not buy software based upon future hopes, but only upon what that software can do now. If the desktop version of Scrivener is not enough for you, and your writing depends upon you having a mobile version right now, then you should look to other solutions. Or you can just use the existing folder sync feature to edit text on your Android phone in the meantime.
I actually take more offence at this than anything else in the diatribe.
I use Word. A lot. I care deeply about what software I use. I have used a lot of different word processing packages in my time so have a great frame of reference, and am probably one of the more evangelical Scrivener users (hell, I even developed an entire new interface for LitnLat to include with the program - and Scapple - for free). I am not obliged by anyone or any organisation to use Word, or to provide them copies in Word format.
I use Word because for some tasks it is the best. It’s a powerful word processor and it’s easy to use. As with any software, there are some aspects of the program that are buggy (the ability to add formatted bullets to a user-defined style sheet, for example) but they tend to be features that only power-users are likely to notice.
It’s not possible to wear out software through use, but if it was both Scrivener and Word would show very heavy signs of wear and tear on my machine by now, and I’d definitely buy both again if I had to.
What did druid or someone call this? ‘Assumed consensus’? Something like that.
What folder sync feature? I don’t recall anything about that in the tutorials.
Too late, we’ve moved on to new topics!
Down with everything! People suck! 
Yay! pigfender for President!
The folder sync feature is sadly Mac-only at the moment - the poster I was responding to was a Mac user.
Wow!
First, thanks for the fast reply (and thanks to everybody else too who chipped in to give… ummm… feedback).
Let’s try to keep this thread civil, and what’s more, alive. There’s no need to be condescending.
Of course you have every right to do business as you see fit and I never argued that anyone has promised to deliver Android app either. Just expressed my views on the matter and this thread seemed like the proper place to do it.
So, I gather there is absolutely no idea even at this point when mobile apps might actually become available (be that iOS, droid or WP)? What is the latest ballpark estimate for release of iOS app?
I personally fail to see how it could be immoral to use the enabling power of Kickstarter to kick start new projects or essentially boost what is already in the works despite being a profitable company.
Crowdfunding is a good way to gauge what stuff people might actually value more (since they are committed to pay in advance for a product that doesn’t yet even exist).
Donations can of course be strictly symbolic in nature in case the originator finds it worrisome that people might suddenly swamp a company with money they have no use for.
That might in fact be the first time I hear of a company essentially saying stronger financial foundation to be a useless thing… 
While ad-hoc solutions can and do work, they honestly leave a lot to be desired.
I suppose I must be the only one here who thinks that this issue we are currently discussing shouldn’t really even be an issue at this day and age, particularly for a profitable company.
It starts to look more like it’s year 1994 rather than 2014 - in a couple of weeks, that is. Just saying.
I merely suggested that a very stripped down mobile version of Scrivener could possibly satisfy needs of many if not in fact most of us.
I could of course be totally wrong about such ponderings, particularly considering the feedback that my post excited.
But we don’t know until we know, and there’s no harm in asking, right?
I wasn’t trying to be mean, and I certainly don’t consider my idea to be wholly unreasonable, nor something that would have to take a great deal of work either (to get it done soonish rather than one dayish).
I must not have realized people to be this sensitive/defensive. My sincerest apologies if I offended anyone’s sensibilities.
PS. Of course I use Word, too. It’s still a MS Word world after all. I just personally prefer doing the actual writing with Scrivener, and a lot of people simply aren’t in the know at all that such a software like Scrivener even exists (which they in all likelihood could find a joy to use otherwise). That is all. Hardly worth to start a pointless fight for.
PPS. And we are not exactly talking about launching a new Windows 9 here. 
“Just” a mobile app (with or without full functionality).
It could possibly take just one motivated geek to come out with a bare bones mobile Scrivener (and that really was all I was asking here) over coming X-mas season, and maybe few beers more to port that version onto other platforms - no?
I believe most folks do tend to buy utility software with the notion that it will be developed further still - to keep up with the times.
I of course bought Scrivener for what it was/is, and wouldn’t change it for anything else on the market. I’d just love to see those mobile apps transform a great desktop experience into “ubiquitous” one…
I truly appreciate what you guys (and gals?) have done - and continue to do - and I think I fully understand that you just don’t want to release half-assed products - like ever.
I simply criticized the chosen strategy. I didn’t mean to offend any soul here or there. For my needs at least it’s a misguided way to go about the “problem”, and while there might be others like me too, I guess we must be squarely in the minority then.
No hard feelings?
In all fairness, your original post didn’t seem the most civil of posts (“I don’t appreciate…”), although perhaps that was just down to Poe’s law.
We’re not putting a date on it as we have learned the hard way that estimating dates just causes disappointment and frustration. 2014 for the iOS version, though, most likely the second half. We are not currently developing an Android version, so that won’t be in 2014.
It would be immoral because we could afford to hire more developers if we thought that would help without needing to use Kickstarter.
But that’s not really what we are interested in. We don’t make software-by-committee. We make the software we want to use, that we believe in, not what we think will be popular. This has always been our mission statement.
I don’t think that’s what I said. I don’t believe in taking people’s money for something not created yet, either, and I have a serious problem with some of the Kickstarter campaigns I see, where developers are asking for money upfront. We make software and make our money through selling it. If people gave us money through Kickstarter, we wouldn’t be able to offer them free copies of the iOS version (because of how the App Store works), so we’d have to produce T-shirts or something silly as a reward instead. It would be a pointless, time-consuming exercise that might raise money but we wouldn’t have much use for it on development anyway, seeing as more developers will not help the project.
You clearly do not run a software company!
Right, and this is civil, is it? Just saying.
As pointed out, you can already use folder sync if you’re on the Mac version if you just want something basic. Just fire up a text-based app on your iPad, edit the documents, and voila, there they are in Scrivener.
Again, the point is that more developers will not help. It would slow things down. We are working very efficiently now. If you have followed the progress of the iOS version, then you will know that one of the main issues was that the original developer had family health issues that caused us to lose months until she had to step away from the project. Since the new developer has been on board, the project has come on in leaps and bounds. It is a myth to think that throwing more money or developers at the project will make it happen faster. It won’t. Right now I work closely with the developer going over everything and testing everything. Having more developers would mean more co-ordination, the Mac version getting less attention while I stepped out and started working as a project co-ordinator, and trying to integrate multiple code parts from various people. It would not work for what we are doing. There is also the question of how we want to work and how we work best. One or two developers is the standard for most iOS, Mac and other shareware software; it works well. The iOS version would have been out this year had it not been for the unfortunate issues our other developer went through. So again, your ideas will not help this project progress.
“Just” indeed. When every component has to be written from scratch and be able to sync with a large desktop application, it is not something trivial that can be written in a matter of weeks. This is the trouble - people always think it should be “easy” to write this or that piece of software. It’s difficult to appreciate that just getting a button to work right can take a week, or that testing and fixing issues with a new view such as the corkboard can take a month (not including the time it takes to write such a custom control in the first place). People don’t realise that a lot of the controls they take for granted have to be coded from scratch. You can’t just “knock up” good software in a matter of weeks or months, not unless it’s a very basic application that just uses stock controls (Scrivener uses barely any, given its corkboard and outliner, and also its heavily modified text engine), or unless you are a huge company with whole teams co-ordinated by managers all with an overview of the project (something that Kickstarter would not help us achieve, and besides, I don’t want to become a middle-manager). When our Windows team came to work on the Windows version, they estimated it would take them six months. It took them two years. When our first iOS developer came on board, she estimated it would take her six months. A year or so later, when she left, it wasn’t even half finished. When our new developer came on board, a much more experienced developer, she thought we could wrap it up in six months - but there’s still lots more to do, months later. It’s difficult to appreciate just how much has to go on under the surface. Often I’ll take a look at my “to do” list and think that I’ll be able to code it in a month, only to find that the first item takes a week on its own. “Just” a mobile app can take every bit as long as some desktop software. And we are not interested in producing something that you can already achieve using folder sync - our mobile version allows you to see and manipulate your whole project via an outliner, corkboard and inspector.
Ha. Good one. I’m choking on my tea here! Seriously, if someone thinks software development and the planning and execution of software such as Scrivener is so easy, let them try. I’ll take great enjoyment in seeing just how far they get in two weeks.
I’ll finish by linking to a Wikipedia article on a very well-established rule and theory of software engineering that another user brought to my attention, the “mythical man month”, which may be of interest to you when you consider my explanation for why your suggestions will not help us for what we are trying to do:
Well, I didn’t (and still don’t) prefer chosen strategy, and that was the very reason I signed up to leave a comment for.
I of course have no other choice but to accept your strategy since you are not willing to change the winning formula in any ways, but it doesn’t mean I’d be happy about that. I’d be lying if I’d say I’m joyous to learn about this.
I generally consider uncivil criticism that of kicking, screaming and cursing - like it would help anything. But we have a different yardstick and that’s fine with me. People are different and that’s a good thing in my opinion.
I naturally admire you for creating stuff you believe in 100% in stead of 90% or 50%. I just wanted to offer an alternative scenario that could possibly prove to be more fruitful for all parties concerned. Bare bones split screen beta (for those who want it) while waiting for the real thing to arrive… That was the general idea.
But with the way things seem to be progressing now, churning out a lil’ program on the side as well would likely make little to no sense - at this point.
No, I don’t run a software business, and don’t intend to either. I’ve understood that you are not originally a “geek” either but a mere mortal who wanted to have a program that didn’t yet exist in the market and consequently had to teach himself to do it by himself. Or thereabouts?
I do realize things don’t happen as easily as flicking a few switches.
But you can certainly make a bare bones program - that I described in my first post - in far, far less time than 20 months. This has been my main - and actually only - point.
I guess I should have known better not to use humor on the internets because it will likely be misinterpreted if only deliberately. My bad.
I haven’t felt the need to comment here before, trusting that you likely know well enough what you are doing, so all those setbacks you mentioned were new information to me. I just happened to finally remember to check out if there are any mobile apps available now. I’m not a frequent follower to say the least. And I was just genuinely surprised that there actually wasn’t any.
Obviously, I should have spent more time browsing this forum to uncover the reasons why this might be, but honestly, we are all pressed for time. I figured I can just leave a quick comment and someone will get back to me. Seemed to work pretty ok with the previous posters at least.
Of course there’s always a learning curve which brings us to the issue at hand which is that sometimes people do make bad judgments - and not infrequently because they insist always doing it their way, the way it’s always been done before.
I think there’s no shame at all in admitting one’s errors. I make them all the time myself and am grateful when people bother to point that out.
Things don’t always go as planned, that is given.
But more than anything you relying on single developers (who grossly underestimated the effort required) with no obvious backup team/plans seems to me honestly like a gross oversight from your part - as a project leader.
So, I’d have to disagree here. In this regard at least more developers (another team) would actually have been beneficial if getting the app out in a timely fashion had been your top priority.
You seem to be taking this awfully personally which wasn’t - and still isn’t - my intention at all.
I thank you for clarifying further the reasons as to why you do and continue to do things the way you do. It’s good to have principles of course, but it’s no good to never review those principles for any reason. Or at least, that’s what I happen to believe in personally very strongly about.
For me Mac version has been solid gold ever since the first stable release. So I personally prefer more eyes on mobile apps and less on desktop - but like I said, that’s just me. One guy’s opinion. You have every right to do it your way, no question about it what so ever.
Merely voiced one opinion which was duly noted and as quickly discarded. No harm done I hope.
I wish you god speed in whatever it is that you are currently most engaged and determined to get done. And for the record, for me at least people disagreeing is normal state of affairs, not something to get worked up over at all. 8)
PS.
I will look into what you - and other good folks here - suggested me to do in stead. It’s just that I don’t really get along with dropbox at all, and actually much prefer to keep the files offline whenever possible. But I reckon that’s my personal hell I just have to learn to deal with.
Peace out.