In my subjective opinion, Vonnegut is not awfully good

wa
wannabe
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Wed Jul 16, 2008 6:48 pm Post

Anyone who thinks Vonnegut sucks should by impaled on a giant hook!

...I was going to write more but this piercing loud noise in my ear disrupts my train of thought, and my eyeglasses give me a headache.

fl
flow
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Tue Jul 22, 2008 2:56 am Post

druid wrote:
flow wrote:i have to say, that may well be the exact reasons that he has absolutely nothing to say to me.


Sure. You can think whatever you wish.
But you're not describing V or his books, only your own inability to value them.
Not sure why you need to be so arrogant and hostile about it, however.
Henry James once gave some good advice to a young writer:
Try to be someone upon whom nothing is ever wasted.


hostile? maybe. it was such a waste of time. i probably should have put the book down much sooner than trying to finish it no matter what. i can't say i learned my lesson with vonnegurt but he was definitely one of the memorable ones.

fl
flow
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Tue Jul 22, 2008 2:58 am Post

druid wrote:My last word on the subject of Vonnegut.

1. Launch Scrivener.
2. Go to Scrivener: About Scrivener.
3. Scroll down to the bottom of the About panel.
4. Read. And admire KB for his restraint, in not commenting on this topic.


that's hilarious.

fl
flow
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Tue Jul 22, 2008 3:01 am Post

wannabe wrote:Anyone who thinks Vonnegut sucks should by impaled on a giant hook!

...I was going to write more but this piercing loud noise in my ear disrupts my train of thought, and my eyeglasses give me a headache.


no, wait. this is even better.

fl
flow
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Tue Jul 22, 2008 8:12 pm Post

i'm going to sign off on this thread. most of what's been said here has been mostly along the lines of "how dare you not like vonnegut?!" little of what i've read here has been educational, enlightening or insightful. or interesting. sorry guys. feel free to have at it without me.

Bo
Bob Wizard
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Tue Jul 22, 2008 10:15 pm Post

Well, gee whiz guy. If the books have a plot, some discernible theme, characterization (vs. stream of consciousness impressions or reflections on one's memory of summer camp) and a style that is coherent, then it really is just a battle of tastes. One author could be demonstrated to be better than another, and that would be a lengthy discussion. Unless, of course, you are pitting Jackie Collins against Dostoyevsky.

But if all you've got is Vonnegut sucks, then I think Vonnegut fans have every right to treat it flippantly.
God, I hate thinking up signatures!

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vic-k
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Tue Jul 22, 2008 10:47 pm Post

I was just going through all your posts, flow, to see if there was any evidence therein, of 'why', you dislike KV with such a passion, but of course there isn`t any. I was jjust about to say something along the lines of: "Well, gee whiz guy. If the books have a plot, some discernible theme, characterization (vs. stream of consciousness impressions or reflections on one's memory of summer camp) and a style that is coherent, then it really is just a battle of tastes. One author could be demonstrated to be better than another, and that would be a lengthy discussion. Unless, of course, you are pitting Jackie Collins against Dostoyevsky.

But if all you've got is Vonnegut sucks, then I think Vonnegut fans have every right to treat it flippantly."
But Bob`s just nipped in a said it better than I could. Cheers Bob :wink:

Take care flow, and watch out for the boredom...it sucks.
vic
As a professional, you, are your one and only asset. Without integrity you are worthless, but with it, you are priceless.

dr
druid
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Wed Jul 23, 2008 4:14 am Post

A better writer, and teacher, than I once wrote that learners fall into four categories:

Smart ones who work.
Smart ones who don't.
Dumb ones who work.
Dumb ones who don't.

So long, flow, and may your journey be full of endless surprise and diversion.

Bo
Bob Wizard
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Wed Jul 23, 2008 11:54 am Post

It was really too immature of an attack for real discussion to begin with. O.k. you think Vonnegut sucks. Why? He is boring. Why? If you are going to be a writer, you have to talk in terms of a writer, not a junior high equivalent of "my rock band blows yours away". Tell me in terms of writing: plot, pacing, character development, climax and resolution, resonance, the overall theme to the events (if it is deep enough - doesn't have to be, I like a well written adventure story as much as the next person) etc.

My favorite author is probably one of the most hated in literary circles - Ayn Rand. Although I hold the glib ivory league literati in no high regard anywho. But, I've met people who can't get through a 60 page speech dealing with philosophical themes in a novel let alone anywhere else (and a few other reasons besides). Even though 600 pages would be like a banquet to me, I can see how some people couldn't stomach it. If they can articulate at least some explanation for a non-favorable review, I'm open to some sort of discussion.

But "it sucks" and "it's boring" is both a sucky and boring explanation I live too short a time to even bother with. You know what? I think I'm going to go out and try some Vonnegut (too bad, Flow, he isn't still here to make the money). Any suggestions?
God, I hate thinking up signatures!

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Wock
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Wed Jul 23, 2008 6:32 pm Post

The argument that beats all other arguments in this case.




"Oh Yeah! My Dad Can Beat Up Your Dad!"




:-)

PS: Using "sucks" in poetry.


Being in love sucks.
Being in love sucks.
A kiss, a hug, and a couple of :oops:
Being in love sucks.
The wheel is turning but the hamster is still dead.

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KB
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Sat Aug 16, 2008 11:30 am Post

Okay, I just came across this thread (I don't moderate the writing forums as heavily as I do the Scrivener area). Suffice to say, I'm not a happy bunny. Not because someone didn't like Vonnegut, mind you, but because of some of the tone in this thread, which isn't what I have come to love about these forums. Whilst users are free to discuss the merits or lack thereof of particular writers - there are plenty of writers I think are overvalued and about which other users would vehemently disagree with me - simply posting "X author sucks" is not really the sort of content I want or expect in this forum, and I would appreciate it if we could keep discussions about writing and authors on a more sensible and mature level. For the record, yes, I am a bit of a Vonnegut fan, although I was moreso in my twenties than I am now. Before anyone claims otherwise, though, hat's not the point. I think Salman Rushdie is overrated, and I threw Midnight's Children down in a fit of rage at his egotistical intellectualism (as a friend described it), but I could explain my precise reasons for doing that, and what's more, that is my own subjective opinion and I certainly wouldn't claim that "Rushdie sucks" - it just happens that his style of writing doesn't appeal to me.

I am therefore closing this thread and renaming it to something less "flame bait"-ish, and I would like to kindly request that in future, where users wish to say that they don't like a particular author - which is absolutely fine - they explain their reasons in a considered manner, taking into consideration what they see as the literary merits or lack thereof, and then remain open to discussion with users who disagree with them. If all you are going to do is come along, make some attacks without backing up your opinions with textual evidence, and then run away saying that everyone else is uninteresting, you should only expect other users to get a bit ratty.

Thank you to those users who exhibited a fair amount of calm and patience in this thread. Hopefully now normal service can be resumed...

Best regards,
Keith