Can anybody help me?

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vic-k
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Thu Sep 13, 2007 6:26 pm Post

The other day, I discovered copies of Wilkie Collins` The Moonstone, and The Woman in White, in the bookcase. God knows how they got there!

I`m now a third of the way through The Moonstone, and up to now, there`s an absolute dearth of sex and violence (gratuitous or otherwise), in it.

Has anyone read these books? Should I dump Moonstone, and start The Woman In White, or is that as bad? I`d feel more optimistic, if it was called The Woman In Black.

Can anyone advise, please?

Thank You
Vic
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Siren
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Thu Sep 13, 2007 6:53 pm Post

vic-k wrote:Should I dump Moonstone, and start The Woman In White, or is that as bad?


I do hope that you're not dissing my favourite author! There's no point looking for dirty bits in Wilkie Collins. Everyone knows that the Victorians only had sex and violence subliminally, probably because these popular pastimes weren't invented properly until the 1960s (or so I've been told). Anyhow, while Wilkie Collins may not go into the detail of any alleged subliminality, just about everything he writes deals with the aftermath of immoral behaviour. You'll just have to use your imagination to fill in the gaps!

PJ
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Thu Sep 13, 2007 6:56 pm Post

If you're a third of the way through and the author has not hooked you with hero, or plot, or mood, or background, or secondary characters or humor or sex or violence or food, I say toss it. No matter who wrote it.

Collins, once enormously popular, is now an acquired taste, and not an easily-acquired one at that.

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Sun Sep 23, 2007 11:37 am Post

You could always insert some gratuitous sex and violence into the story and then give the book away to corrupt somebody, hopefully a minor.

Paul

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vic-k
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Sun Sep 23, 2007 1:05 pm Post

Siren,
Whatever is going on subconsciously, I`m not sure of but on a conscious level, at the moment, most of my life`s occurrences, must be happening subliminally, because as far as I can figure out, nothings happening.

Have you read `Rebecca's Tale`, by Sally Beauman? It`s du Maurier`s `Rebecca`, twenty years hence. Having swapped it for `Moonstone`( which I will resume later), I found some quite stark similarities between Collins`s book and Beauman`s. Check it out, see what you think.

Phil,
The dearth of sex and violence, notwithstanding, (in the book!!), I am, actually intrigued by the plot`s final resolution.

Whether or not I become intimate with `The Woman in White`, will most likely depend upon, just how adept I become at subliminal fornication.

Paul,
Exposing today`s minors to S and V, would be invoking the proverbial "Ice-cream/ Eskimo; Coal /Newcastle clichés. They`re actually rewriting the Instruction Manual.

Take care
Vic
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Siren
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Sun Sep 23, 2007 3:45 pm Post

vic-k wrote:Have you read `Rebecca's Tale`, by Sally Beauman? It`s du Maurier`s `Rebecca`, twenty years hence. Having swapped it for `Moonstone`( which I will resume later), I found some quite stark similarities between Collins`s book and Beauman`s. Check it out, see what you think.

Sounds interesting. I'll put it on the list. So many books, so little time... :-)

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Thu Jun 05, 2008 1:52 pm Post

Siren wrote:There's no point looking for dirty bits in Wilkie Collins. Everyone knows that the Victorians only had sex and violence subliminally, probably because these popular pastimes weren't invented properly until the 1960s (or so I've been told).


In reality, of course, they had so much sex and violence at home that they didn't want to have to read about it too. Just too tiring, you know, old chep!

Reminds me of a Brockbank (circa 1960s, car cartoons) cartoon which shows a mob of gangsters in a car roaring down the road with tommy guns blazing, pursued by police with revolvers blazing.

Two little old ladies are standing at the side of the road. One says to the other: "You'd think we got enough of that on TV without having to put up with it in real life too!"

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vic-k
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Thu Jun 05, 2008 7:28 pm Post

gm.
Welcome to 'The Little Shop of Horrors' or The Good Ship,as we call Scriv.

Strange you should resurrect this thread, because I`ve very recently finished 'Moonstone', and I have only a hundred pages to go with, 'The Woman in White'. Definitely a dearth of 'raunch'. You wouldn`t think Collins and Charlie Dickens were a couple of likely lad, where the ladies and the hostelries were concerned, or so I`ve been led to believe.
Take care
Vic
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Thu Jun 05, 2008 8:08 pm Post

You need to revisit Hardy to get your fix of Victorian raunch. Although even there it's understated. Gentlemen (and Ladies) may have done it to distraction, but they didn't really talk about it--and certainly didn't write about it.

But Bathsheba Everdene? Tess d'Urberville? Eustacia Vye? Sue Bridehead?

All still major boner material a century and change later.

As was (from the Bronte who could write), the delectable Catherine Earnshaw.

Sorry. Must go blot my brow.

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vic-k
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Thu Jun 05, 2008 10:23 pm Post

My wife s dissertation at Teacher Training College, Huddersfield, Yorkshire, was on the Brontes.
So we`ve been all over the Bronte trail up to, 'Top Withins', numerous time. Out on those moors, is a very, 'Sap Rising', experience. If you get my drift 8)
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Thu Jun 05, 2008 11:07 pm Post

vic-k wrote:So we`ve been all over the Bronte trail up to, 'Top Withins', numerous time. Out on those moors, is a very, 'Sap Rising', experience. If you get my drift 8)

Hope you were not such as dog as to fail to take your hat off, is all I can say.

Martin Cruz Smith refers to some written raunch (erotica, the Bishop called it, of course, dirty books for the upper claws) which predated Victoria by several hundred years in "Rose". Speaking as one who has suffered some nasty bouts of malaria, and exalted in one (cerebral on that occasion -- best trip I EVER had, why, of why, did they inject the chloroquin? I didn't ask for it), and who is a bit of a student of social development, it is an excellent book.

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vic-k
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Thu Jun 05, 2008 11:25 pm Post

greenmorpher wrote:Hope you were not such as dog as to fail to take your hat off, is all I can say

Indubitably! What d` you think I am? A Mongrel?

greenmorpher wrote:best trip I EVER had, why, of why, did they inject the chloroquin? I didn't ask for it),

Life`s a bitch! :(
Take care
Vic
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Sat Jun 07, 2008 5:06 am Post

Siren wrote:
vic-k wrote:Should I dump Moonstone, and start The Woman In White, or is that as bad?


I do hope that you're not dissing my favourite author! There's no point looking for dirty bits in Wilkie Collins. Everyone knows that the Victorians only had sex and violence subliminally, probably because these popular pastimes weren't invented properly until the 1960s (or so I've been told). Anyhow, while Wilkie Collins may not go into the detail of any alleged subliminality, just about everything he writes deals with the aftermath of immoral behaviour. You'll just have to use your imagination to fill in the gaps!


Shame on you for having such a quaint view of the Victorian era. For your penance, I proscribe Michel Foucault's 'History of Sexuality, Volume 1'. Read through that, and tell me again that Victorian's didn't have sex on the brain in the most twisted of ways.
sincères amitiés,
Monsieur Clangy Bangy

But t'weren't the Almighty that lifted her nighty...'twas Roger the lodger, the dodger!

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vic-k
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Sat Jun 07, 2008 12:22 pm Post

Black Fellah,
Don`t fall into trap siren sets for the unwary. There`s no two ways about this!! Siren` is a multi-substance abusing, redhot mama, of a Femme Fatale. When she posts, you`ll see little curls of steam escaping from Mac`s casing :twisted:
Vic
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MarcustheBlacksmith
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Sat Jun 07, 2008 12:49 pm Post

Ah, I see. She deploys this 'wit' and 'satire' I've heard so much about. I'll have to learn how to wield it myself, one of these days.
:twisted: :twisted:
sincères amitiés,
Monsieur Clangy Bangy

But t'weren't the Almighty that lifted her nighty...'twas Roger the lodger, the dodger!