Windows 3 release

Be
Beobuck
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Sun Oct 13, 2019 4:57 pm Post

When last I communicated with Scrivener, after they missed the Aug. 31 release date, they said be patient, it will be "weeks not months." It's now going on two months with no release in sight, and no information about how the work is proceeding. What gives? I can't imagine any other company that would treat it customer base this way.

Be
Beobuck
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Sun Oct 13, 2019 5:34 pm Post

Beobuck again. I want it understood that I consider Scrivener my friends and look forward to working with them. But it's a poor friend that says I'll meet you at a particular time and then never shows up. Also, I don't want to hear, "Quit your bitching, Beobuck, you can always use the beta. Well, if the beta was all ok it wouldn't be a beta and wouldn't need to be replaced every month. My best wishes to the Windows 3 team; I only wish they would treat me as a friend and let me know what's going on.

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kewms
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Sun Oct 13, 2019 5:39 pm Post

When Windows Scrivener 3 is ready to release, we will release it.

"What's going on" is that bugs are being hunted and work is being done. Whether you choose to install the beta or not, the release notes in the beta forum are the best indicator of the progress that is occurring.

Katherine
Scrivener Support Team

Sy
Synth
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Mon Oct 14, 2019 3:46 pm Post

The changelog each month shows a lot of progress.
They thought it was near completion, but bugs pile up, so they have to fix those before release. It's easy to over or under estimate when we're talking about software development.
The "lack of communication" perceived is a bit weird, but they are communicating. Check the logs each month, and you'll see progress being made. I would rather get that than an apology blog each month telling me it's not coming this month like we thought because of x and y which we know already why, we've seen the log.
It'll come when it'll come is a less than ideal marketing strategy I'll give you that, but since they can't seem to pin down when it'll release by months, it's the most appropriate one.

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lunk
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Mon Oct 14, 2019 3:54 pm Post

Beobuck wrote:I can't imagine any other company that would treat it customer base this way.
Beobuck wrote:I only wish they would treat me as a friend
Friend, or customer? That’s not the same, is it?

Is there something special you need to do that you can’t do with 1.9 but you think can be done with 3.0? Explain the problem and people in here will probably try to help you.
I am a user, writing non-fiction and science, using:
* Mac Scrivener 3 on a Macbook 12”, MacBook Pro 13”, and iMac 27”, all running Mojave.
* iOS Scrivener 1 on an iPhone 11 Pro, iPad Air 9.7”, and iPad Pro 12.9”, all running the latest iOS

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UK3D
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Tue Oct 15, 2019 12:10 pm Post

I am relatively new to Scrivener but chose it because it's a great solution recommended by many writers. I work flexibly across Mac and PC so the promise of Scrivener 3 for PC was an important part of my decision making. I bought both versions. The long delays are somewhat perplexing. I have worked with developers on many complex programs and I understand delays and fixes and wanting to be perfect on day of launch. What is not acceptable in any circumstance is to keep your customers in the dark. You should look to Blender.org as an example of how to keep their client base informed, enthused and happy.

At this stage weekly updates should be issued. We only need a few lines to know progress is being made. What challenges you face etc. I am sure we are a forgiving bunch given the opportunity. This responsibility usually falls to the manager of the developers or a senior person in the company. Where is that person and what excuse do they have for this extended silence?

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lunk
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Tue Oct 15, 2019 1:07 pm Post

The progress can be followed if you look at the change log:

viewtopic.php?f=57&t=40621

Latest update Oct 10th 2019 (scroll down and you'll find the date below the change log)
I am a user, writing non-fiction and science, using:
* Mac Scrivener 3 on a Macbook 12”, MacBook Pro 13”, and iMac 27”, all running Mojave.
* iOS Scrivener 1 on an iPhone 11 Pro, iPad Air 9.7”, and iPad Pro 12.9”, all running the latest iOS

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kewms
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Tue Oct 15, 2019 4:29 pm Post

UK3D wrote:At this stage weekly updates should be issued. We only need a few lines to know progress is being made. What challenges you face etc. I am sure we are a forgiving bunch given the opportunity. This responsibility usually falls to the manager of the developers or a senior person in the company. Where is that person and what excuse do they have for this extended silence?


As noted, the beta forum has abundant information.

The development team -- actually two people -- has prioritized writing code over talking about it. This position is endorsed by "senior management," also known as L&L's founder. https://www.literatureandlatte.com/blog ... her-delays
We really appreciate your enthusiasm for the product and Lee and Tiho* will continue working at full throttle until Scrivener 3 is ready. We’re not going to give another release date until everything is fixed and working properly.


Recent history tells us that, while *some* forum users are indeed a "forgiving bunch," detailed updates lead to increasingly vitriolic complaints about the development team's performance, up to and including demands that they be fired.

When Windows Scrivener 3 is ready for release, we will release it.

Katherine
Scrivener Support Team

Ra
Raylex
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Wed Oct 16, 2019 7:57 am Post

I feel my bad English translated by Google.

I am delighted with Scrivener and I am going to buy my version for Windows.

Also say that, complaining is the most widespread free sport.
Simply people will never be happy.

My full support for Scrivener. ;-)
When Windows Scrivener 3 is ready for launch, we will launch it.

Be
Beobuck
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Wed Oct 16, 2019 5:23 pm Post

Beobuck here. Your replies to my complaints have convinced me to be more patient and not be bitchy. I NEVER suggested Lee and Tiho be fired, but I would appreciate an encouraging word now and then. If I wasn't a big fan of Scrivener I would not be so eager for the new version.,

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philjaq
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Fri Oct 18, 2019 10:59 am Post

On top of the bug fixing in V3, the devs were probably impacted by the catastrophic troubles caused by their having to change their software registration contractors last summer. See the multiple threads in the Technical Support (Windows) forum for details.

Tiho, at least, was involved in many of those threads and announced two intermediate fixes plus a new version release, 1.9.14.0, in attempts to correct the issues. These were not entirely successful. Then on the 13th October, yet another version, 1.9.15.0, was issued and it will probably require a few weeks before we know if the problems are completely resolved.

All that problem solving for V1 must have had some impact on dev performance on V3 - not to mention the stress which seems to be evident in the uncharacteristically abrupt post by Katherine in her initial reply to the OP above.

However, one can understand and forgive much if communications are excellent and timely. Unfortunately, that has not always been the case with L and L.

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UK3D
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Fri Oct 25, 2019 8:46 am Post

Kewms thanks for the links, I was hopeful I had missed something useful and would be able to see the state of play on v3 for windows. Alas both links are not really helpful. Since July all we have is a list of beta updates not a progress report and the second is as we all know a blog telling us they have again had to push back the release date.

I have read the good and the bad responses in the forum with some taking the defensive on L&L behalf with others attacking. My conclusion is we are all quite passionate about Scrivener and are keen to have parity across operating systems. Some of their customers have been extremely patient. I don't think it is asking too much to keep us informed on progress or lack there of. To those who think they should be doing rather than telling are missing the point in a professional environment both are required. Leave the programmers to do their work by all means but someone somewhere in the organisation should take responsibility for keeping their customers informed.

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devinganger
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Fri Oct 25, 2019 9:11 am Post

Until they release version 3, their paying customers aren't buying version 3, but 1.9 and a free upgrade. That's the report. No matter what report they release, a vocal minority won't be happy with it. Why should a small company overload their people only to catch more flak, when they could be focused on taking care of the current concerns? Flak is coming their way no matter what.

If anyone wants to more, they are invited to download the beta, install it, and play with it. Then you'll know fairly immediately what the status is for the areas of Scrivener that are important to you. Inevitably, status updates leave people unhappy because their pet feature didn't get mentioned.
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Devin L. Ganger, WA7DLG
Not a L&L employee; opinions are those of my cat
Winner "Best in Class", 2018 My First Supervillain Photo Shoot

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kewms
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Fri Oct 25, 2019 4:12 pm Post

UK3D wrote:Kewms thanks for the links, I was hopeful I had missed something useful and would be able to see the state of play on v3 for windows. Alas both links are not really helpful. Since July all we have is a list of beta updates not a progress report and the second is as we all know a blog telling us they have again had to push back the release date.


Uh, the beta updates *are* the progress reports, Each new beta post reports the changes since the previous beta. What exactly are you looking for, if not that?

Katherine
Scrivener Support Team