I know you are, but what am I?

Tw
Twolane
Posts: 280
Joined: Sat May 12, 2012 7:39 pm
Platform: Windows

Tue Apr 13, 2021 10:22 am Post

too little, too late and for too high a price

Well, to be fair, L&L did give away Win v3 for years, and people weren't happy with that, either. So, I guess it all evens out now that they're charging for it, and people still aren't happy. Go figure.

ta
takirks
Posts: 46
Joined: Tue Oct 22, 2019 6:42 pm
Platform: Windows

Tue Apr 13, 2021 4:23 pm Post

Wow... I thought I was a cheap bastard.

Y'all really ought to go price software services and support out in the real world, where similar products to Scrivener in other specialized fields are priced at exponentially higher prices. Software development ain't cheap--I've paid $5,000.00 plus for a piece of really badly written crapware that I had to have because it's the "industry standard", and between the onerous BS with the software dongles and annual maintenance fees of around a thousand bucks a year, I'm looking at Scrivener as a great bargain in comparison. I might also add that said software has yet to make me a dime, due to changing business conditions/plans...

You could always do your writing in something like LibreOffice, and do everything for free. But, then you'd have to forego all the writer-specific toolkit that Scrivener has.

User avatar
drmajorbob
Posts: 912
Joined: Sun Jul 01, 2012 1:38 am
Platform: Mac

Wed Apr 14, 2021 4:01 am Post

Wysardry wrote:So I need to have posted a certain number of times before being allowed to have a negative comment about the product?

I've owned the previous version since 2012 and could hardly post about version 3 before now when I only just found out about it finally being available.

I already found a suitable alternative for my needs for a cheaper price, but I might have upgraded anyway if the price had been right, which it wasn't.

$45 every 9 years is too much?

(2012 to now)

$5 a year?

Wow.
Teeth, without gums, fall loosely in the mouth.

(I'm not a Literature & Latte employee. Just another user.)

Ru
RuffPub
Posts: 165
Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2020 1:51 am
Platform: Mac + Windows

Wed Apr 14, 2021 5:04 am Post

Wysardry wrote:So I need to have posted a certain number of times before being allowed to have a negative comment about the product?

I've owned the previous version since 2012 and could hardly post about version 3 before now when I only just found out about it finally being available.

I already found a suitable alternative for my needs for a cheaper price, but I might have upgraded anyway if the price had been right, which it wasn't.


So if you found an ‘alternative...cheaper price’ why the need to come on and bitch and troll? Just enjoy the bargain you claim to have found.

I’ve looked and haven’t found anything close except at a higher and often recurring price. I guess your idea of ‘right’ price is very different from the thousands(?) who have happily upgraded.

Wy
Wysardry
Posts: 7
Joined: Tue Apr 13, 2021 6:35 am
Platform: Windows

Wed Apr 14, 2021 5:50 am Post

If the $5000 piece of software you mention is only similar to Scrivener then it is not relevant or you have to take into consideration that other similar software is cheaper or even free.

Another reason to avoid comparisons with other software is that some companies don't charge for upgrades at all.

My main problems with the current price point are that:-

a) The price went up shortly before the release of version 3 for Windows, so Windows users are basically being fined for the delay.

b) The cost in GBP is higher than in USD (even with VAT added) despite L&L being based in the UK. $49 + 20% = $58.80 but £47 is currently equal to about $64.64

c) The discount for current long term users of Scrivener is 49% when new buyers with a NaNoWriMo voucher get 50% off.

Considering the extended wait for v3, the state of the global economy and that no currency conversion fees (for L&L) would apply to UK buyers, a price point of £40 with a 50% discount for existing users would have seemed fairer to me.

Ru
RuffPub
Posts: 165
Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2020 1:51 am
Platform: Mac + Windows

Wed Apr 14, 2021 6:07 am Post

L&L don’t charge for point upgrades, like many others. I have yet to find ANY who don’t charge for major upgrades unless you buy an overpriced ‘lifetime’ licence or have an equally expensive sub.

You realise how cheap it sounds quibbling over such a small price change in an attempt to justify your position? L&L are a commercial business, not some charity. They gave it free to anyone who purchased after the announcement. The rest of us get a very powerful (exceptional) piece of software at extremely competitive pricing.

The nearest actual competitor is subscription, short on some features but costs near that every year.

As my Yorkshire dad used to say, ‘no satisfying some folks!’

Wy
Wysardry
Posts: 7
Joined: Tue Apr 13, 2021 6:35 am
Platform: Windows

Wed Apr 14, 2021 7:07 am Post

You realise that this forum is for customer feedback directed at L&L, not for customers to try and discredit anyone with an opinion that differs from theirs, right?

I've been polite with my feedback and given my reasons for doing so. If you don't agree, then that is your problem not mine.

Ru
RuffPub
Posts: 165
Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2020 1:51 am
Platform: Mac + Windows

Wed Apr 14, 2021 8:55 am Post

You realise this is a forum for discussion amongst users as well as feedback?

You are entitled to voice your opinion, just as others (apparently the vast majority) are entitled to call you out and disagree.

If you don't agree, then that is your problem not mine. :lol:

Wy
Wysardry
Posts: 7
Joined: Tue Apr 13, 2021 6:35 am
Platform: Windows

Wed Apr 14, 2021 9:27 am Post

Well, to me this seems less like a discussion and more like an argument with a bunch of Obvionesque Adoring Fans, but that's just my opinion.

In any case, I shall not be continuing it as I've said all I needed to.

ta
takirks
Posts: 46
Joined: Tue Oct 22, 2019 6:42 pm
Platform: Windows

Wed Apr 14, 2021 4:27 pm Post

People like you are why so many open-source projects die. Why? Because you treat the developers like crap, demand things you've no right to, and whine incessantly about reality.

Developing for Windows is not cheap; there's a small development team, and they have to earn a living or there's no way the development of new software is going to happen. Your complaints about being asked to pay for this process are both immature and morally bankrupt--You don't want the software? Fine; go away. Don't come here whining about what are very generous terms for the new software version. You won't see terms like that anywhere else in the small-industry bespoke software field. L&L is being very honest and very "nice" about this, and you're behaving like a spoiled child in return.

Good God, I'd love to hear your whinge-fest over some of the things I have to put up with in my day job, where the software sales types don't even blink when they start talking about a $3,000.00 monthly subscription fee for a minimum of 12 months for a piece of essential yet buggy and nearly unusable crapware that they have us over the barrel on. It's like being mugged over the internet... And, paying for the privilege.

Wy
Wysardry
Posts: 7
Joined: Tue Apr 13, 2021 6:35 am
Platform: Windows

Wed Apr 14, 2021 9:32 pm Post

Ah, I see. When an existing customer has a query about why the price has risen more for people paying in UK currency than in US dollars, moderators move their posts to some random thread for other users to make random insults and ludicrous comments about.

Stellar customer service. But that's okay, as they aren't a charity after all. :roll:

Tw
Twolane
Posts: 280
Joined: Sat May 12, 2012 7:39 pm
Platform: Windows

Thu Apr 15, 2021 1:46 pm Post

they aren't a charity

Exactly. Now go write something using the software of your choice. You'll be able to produce more output, faster, than by using a product you have no use for, but continue to whine and snivel about.

Wy
Wysardry
Posts: 7
Joined: Tue Apr 13, 2021 6:35 am
Platform: Windows

Thu Apr 15, 2021 10:12 pm Post

I'm surprised that some of you can write anything worthwhile using any software, given your poor reading comprehension levels.

I went to the L&L site originally to find out if v3 was out yet (which means I actually like v1.9).

My objections were that due to the long wait the price went up from what it was during NaNoWriMo in November and that it went up more for anyone who had to pay in UK currency.

If it had been available for $45 + VAT (- a 50% discount for the upgrade) and I could would only have to pay that amount rather than have an extra fee on top for no obvious reason, I'd likely have grumbled to myself about the wait and probably bought it.

Given how toxic these forums seem to have become and L&L's total lack of interest in this issue, I'm highly unlikely to renew either of their products that I previously paid for, nor continue to recommend others to buy them.

But hey, at least you can continue to feel smug about the fun you've had by ganging up on someone less fanatical than yourselves, eh?

Me
Merx
Posts: 81
Joined: Sat Feb 27, 2021 6:59 am
Platform: Mac

Fri Apr 16, 2021 8:49 am Post

Wysardry wrote:Given how toxic these forums seem to have become and L&L's total lack of interest in this issue, I'm highly unlikely to renew either of their products that I previously paid for, nor continue to recommend others to buy them.

But hey, at least you can continue to feel smug about the fun you've had by ganging up on someone less fanatical than yourselves, eh?


You are right and right, IMO.

If you want software for writing, as well as a more open-minded and supportive community, take a look at:

https://forum.obsidian.md

https://obsidian.md

Merx

Tw
Twolane
Posts: 280
Joined: Sat May 12, 2012 7:39 pm
Platform: Windows

Fri Apr 16, 2021 9:26 am Post

software for writing

All for the mere pittance of 50 a year. And it's a Beta download. Of course.