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Re: iOS Update

Posted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 11:13 am
by charlie.stross
I'm currently working on a project in Scrivener that involves writing books 7-9 of an ongoing series (this one). The Scriv project currently is only about 36Mb in overall size, but the core document is more than 720,000 words long and will be in the 900,000-1,000,000 word range when it's finished (yes, I'm slinging around multiple novels in one project, with keywords and links).

Because I am a lunatic who enjoys living dangerously (modulo having three different parallel backup strategies and disaster recovery plans) I'm looking forward to loading this brick into Scriv on iOS as soon as possible so I can see what breaks.

Re: iOS Update

Posted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 6:47 pm
by Kensai
Byword on my iPod Touch 5 chokes just trying to open a Dropbox folder that has about 150 TXT files in it containing a similar total amount of words. That wasn't the case just one version and one OS update ago. It seems that performance is certainly going to be a question mark, especially for for the lesser but still compatible devices. There is an obvious learning curve at work here, no matter how much shiny new functionality the new OS provides. Even with Mr. Stross knocking on doors here, I think we still have a bit of a justifiable wait on our hands.

Re: iOS Update

Posted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 8:59 am
by ptram
Kensai, have you disabled (what I think is called in English) Documents & Data Synching and Background App Update? With them turned off, my iPhone 4 with iOS 7 is no slower than with iOS 6.

My iPad mini seems as "fast", but I've left transparencies turned on, and the UI is a bit stuttering when returning to the home page. Otherwise, it seems as fine as in the past.

Paolo

Re: iOS Update

Posted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 11:47 am
by cdyard
I installed iOS7 on my iPhone 4 mainly to be able to use Scrivener when it's available. My iPhone is faster with iOS7 than with iOS6! Faster and more reliable too so I'm really satisfied. I just hope Scrivener for iOS will run on an iPhone 4...

Re: iOS Update

Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 12:15 am
by Kensai
Its not really general performance that's the issue, though I did go through and look for what you mentioned and then sussed out a few more things buried in the new settings. Then I went into Byword, opened a new doc, typed a sentence and it promptly locked up. Left the app and came back at different times and it still took several minutes for it to free up, and then managed to do it again. That combined with all sorts of other reported issues that have cropped up between version 2.0 and 2.1, the main difference of which is the switch to iOS 7's Text Kit, have me a bit worried about Scrivener's performance where the rubber meets the road. You know, where the words actually happen, not so much whatever other Scrivener functionality makes the leap to iOS. Text Kit should be able to give us an awesome editor, I just think its got at least a few hidden quirks, is all.

Re: iOS Update

Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 6:20 am
by Flexo
AmberV wrote:I'm not sure if we've come out firm on iOS 7 being a requirement yet, but the fact is anything prior to that version requires us to roll our entire editor from scratch

Umm, if this hasn't been decided yet, does that mean the text engine isn't implemented yet? And if so, does that mean that Scrivener for iOS is still in its early stages? As in "if we're lucky, it'll come out in 2014?"

Re: iOS Update

Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 10:47 am
by KB
Flexo wrote:
AmberV wrote:I'm not sure if we've come out firm on iOS 7 being a requirement yet, but the fact is anything prior to that version requires us to roll our entire editor from scratch

Umm, if this hasn't been decided yet, does that mean the text engine isn't implemented yet? And if so, does that mean that Scrivener for iOS is still in its early stages? As in "if we're lucky, it'll come out in 2014?"


There's a lot more to Scrivener than its text system, so it's by no means in the early stages. We've been getting everything else working first. But no, the text system isn't implemented yet, for the reasons that have already been discussed. It will be released in 2014 no matter how lucky you are.

Kensai - you can rest assured that we do not release *anything* without thorough testing with a decent beta group, and if there are significant performance issues in the iOS 7 text kit, then we will have to find another solution.

Re: iOS Update

Posted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 2:22 pm
by Flexo
Makes sense, thanks.
That it won't be this year hurts a little, but whenever it's ready [cue Barney Stinson], I. Will. Be. There.

Re: iOS Update

Posted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 4:57 pm
by NorthboundTrain
Will there be any way to encrypt Scrivener documents when syncing through DropBox?

Re: iOS Update

Posted: Sun Oct 06, 2013 12:20 am
by Kensai
Wasn't suggesting that, KB.

Just expressing my doubts as to Text Kit being quite the holy grail some have made it out to be and that getting acceptable performance out of it might add to dev time in this instance. Mainly just trying to put some brakes on a mounting sense of, "hey, maybe they'll release it early enough for me to use for NaNo, even if its full of bugs" that I've been getting from various quarters.

Just make plans to use it for NaNo 2014, folks. I imagine it'll be out and at least modestly updated by then. Right now, participants need to focus on the stable tools they already have. If you're insisting on using Scrivener and your iOS devices, you'll just need to put a bit of thought into how to streamline a process with what you already have on hand.

Get Dropbox set up if you don't have it already, pick a text editor that uses it (IA Writer is my preference, Byword is awesome as well, and could be in the running if they patch the performance issues I've been seeing in it on my iPod Touch 5, though it seems stable enough on my son's iPad 4 as is; there are tons of others, but only some are going to be worthy; remember, being feature rich is pointless for this app as you'll just be writing prose), then when you're at your desktop, just import your new text file(s) and stick them where they need to go in Scrivener. A little work by hand isn't going to hurt anyone, and might give you extra moments looking at your project's structure which likely won't hurt either.

I know on my end, even with a BT keyboard available, the iPod, or even swiping my son's iPad, is really just a stop gap, and having the iPod in my pocket and using the onscreen keyboard is just that thing that keeps me from going crazy, worried that I'm going to forget all the great ideas I get while away from the keyboard (its not entirely true, but it does help ;-p ). In that sense, I feel that having an iOS end to the Scrivener equation is really just a way to keep my head in the game while I'm mobile, and make what little text I do generate while on the move more useful, rather than some magic bullet. Then again, writing is a long game, every little bit compounds across a career.

Re: iOS Update

Posted: Sun Oct 06, 2013 12:21 pm
by radicaldog
2014? Argh. L&L sold me an iPad last year, and now is going to sell me a MacBook Air 11''. Oh well, better this way than not having Scrivener at all.

Re: iOS Update

Posted: Sun Oct 06, 2013 6:12 pm
by ReadySetWrite
I've just read through this thread, as I've been lagging on keeping up on iOS progress. So happy that it's gaining ground! Disappointed that it won't be available for Nano 2013, but it happens and I'm just happy you aren't releasing a half-baked piece of software that doesn't sync and loses words :P. Can't wait to use it with 2014.

I was also wondering two things: 1) Do you have any idea of what the price for it will be (under $10, under $5, over $15...), and 2) Will it be a universal download (ie, do I have to pay for it twice on iPad and iPod/iPhone). Basically, what I'm saying is that I'm a student with a small budget and I want to make sure that I'll have enough money to purchase it the minute it appears in the App Store.

Re: iOS Update

Posted: Mon Oct 07, 2013 11:34 pm
by Kensai
Can't speak as to pricing, but my guess is it'll be at least $19.99 just to keep it in close-ish parity with its sibs on other OSes without being entirely out of the price range for that market. I could be wrong, obviously since I'm just a bystander, but that is my reasoned expectation.

They have, however, made it pretty clear that its a universal app. Basically the iPhone/Pod displays one "column" worth at a time and the iPad will be able to display up to 3, each column being something like the Binder, the Inspector, the Editor, or a second Editor. Again, my specific words are my speculation, but if you look back in this thread, know KB and possibly Amber have described it as something to that effect.

Re: iOS Update

Posted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 12:35 pm
by Mishenka
About due for a major iOS Update, don't you think? The last update in the Blog came out in April 2013. :(

I'm picturing the following: A stocking stuffer for Christmas ????

Re: iOS Update

Posted: Sat Oct 12, 2013 4:32 pm
by floatingbones
Kensai wrote:Just expressing my doubts as to Text Kit being quite the holy grail some have made it out to be and that getting acceptable performance out of it might add to dev time in this instance.

I wanted to place this in a bit of context. Pages and Numbers for iOS have been out since January, 2010; both of these [internal] apps require the kind of API that has now been externalized in TextKit. AAPL essentially has had ~4 years of development on this API, and that doesn't count the pedigree of the similar code base on OS X.

Of course, new problems will be exposed with hundreds/thousands of developers start banging on a new large API. OTOH, developers have had it for four months. I'm confident the code is good and that any bugs and performance issues will be dealt with promptly.

I think it's proper to expect the iOS version for the 2014 event and be pleasantly surprised if it's available this November.